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Post by ivangolac on Jun 29, 2020 17:56:37 GMT
Good for thought...
All these players taking a knee....Black Lives Matter......
Arsenal sponsored by Emirates....Black Lives Matter, just not Pakistani building contractors.
Man City sponsored by Etihad...Black Lives Matter, just not Bangladeshi as above.
Rashford on a knee with Chevrolet and Kohler on his shirt, oh dear, they don’t stack up that well....
Is it Black Lives Matter, but you are ok because you are paying me?
Just an observation.
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budidgary
First Team Player
Blimey
Posts: 411
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Post by budidgary on Jun 30, 2020 7:57:57 GMT
Add to that, the world cup to be paid in Qatar where slaves lives most certainly do not matter and good ole Lewis Hamilton, demanding statues be removed while driving for a german company who helped fund the Nazi's.
We could even add to that, all sports people, indeed anyone wearing brand named clothes, against slavery but happy to wear clothes made in SE Asia Sweatshops by children/slaves. Before anyone says these places do not exist, please remember I live here and have seen them and know the conditions, payment and background of the kids in questions (often orphaned, sold).
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Post by jickster on Jun 30, 2020 10:17:30 GMT
It's almost impossible to be a part of society without in some way contributing to individuals or organisations that don't go along with your own principles. I don't think it makes you a hypocrite.
The basic idea of using a public profile to highlight certain causes is a good one. It's petty to start picking people up because there are also other causes that they are not currently highlighting, or implying that they don't care about them. If we can all make minor improvements however we can, then eventually they might add up to a big improvement. I accept that at the moment this looks to be a losing battle, but these people are trying to play their part in their own way.
To take the World Cup in Qatar as an example, that has been massively problematic from day one, and maybe footballers should refuse to play in it, but that's a ridiculously high standard to hold them to.
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budidgary
First Team Player
Blimey
Posts: 411
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Post by budidgary on Jun 30, 2020 10:27:34 GMT
It's almost impossible to be a part of society without in some way contributing to individuals or organisations that don't go along with your own principles. I don't think it makes you a hypocrite. The basic idea of using a public profile to highlight certain causes is a good one. It's petty to start picking people up because there are also other causes that they are not currently highlighting, or implying that they don't care about them. If we can all make minor improvements however we can, then eventually they might add up to a big improvement. I accept that at the moment this looks to be a losing battle, but these people are trying to play their part in their own way. To take the World Cup in Qatar as an example, that has been massively problematic from day one, and maybe footballers should refuse to play in it, but that's a ridiculously high standard to hold them to.Why is it? If they can take a knee and truly believe in BLM and eridicating the wrongs of slavery past and present, they should refuse to play in a country that is still very guilty of putting certain peoples lives aside in the name of progress and profit.
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Post by jickster on Jun 30, 2020 11:18:15 GMT
Because the action they'd need to take is so extreme, denying themselves the pinnacle of their career, that I don't think many people would take it. FIFA shafted everybody, players and fans, and most of all workers that had to build the stadia, with their corrupt bidding process that awarded it. So as fans, we can choose to do things like not travel there, not watch it on TV, not buy things from companies that sponsor it etc. But how many will actually do that? I disapprove of it being there, but fact is I'm still going to watch it as are all but a tiny minority of football fans. Credit to them for doing that, I wish I had the moral backbone to take more stands like that, but I don't. For players, it's a similar story but an even more extreme step to take, not just not watching some football but deliberately denying yourself the chance of a World Cup that even great players sometimes only get once or twice. I would really applaud any player who actually did so, but I couldn't condemn them for not, because I know that I would choose to play.
Maybe I've just become so ground down in my expectations of people that I've let my own standards slip, but at least I'm honest about that. And likewise, I think that the players are only human and it is unfair to expect them to be better than the majority of us. In doing so, I think it's fine to be participating in a well publicised and worthy cause, but not to demand that they must follow that through by going beyond what others are doing in other circumstances.
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Post by choixkoix on Jun 30, 2020 12:51:19 GMT
Because the action they'd need to take is so extreme, denying themselves the pinnacle of their career, that I don't think many people would take it. FIFA shafted everybody, players and fans, and most of all workers that had to build the stadia, with their corrupt bidding process that awarded it. So as fans, we can choose to do things like not travel there, not watch it on TV, not buy things from companies that sponsor it etc. But how many will actually do that? I disapprove of it being there, but fact is I'm still going to watch it as are all but a tiny minority of football fans. Credit to them for doing that, I wish I had the moral backbone to take more stands like that, but I don't. For players, it's a similar story but an even more extreme step to take, not just not watching some football but deliberately denying yourself the chance of a World Cup that even great players sometimes only get once or twice. I would really applaud any player who actually did so, but I couldn't condemn them for not, because I know that I would choose to play. Maybe I've just become so ground down in my expectations of people that I've let my own standards slip, but at least I'm honest about that. And likewise, I think that the players are only human and it is unfair to expect them to be better than the majority of us. In doing so, I think it's fine to be participating in a well publicised and worthy cause, but not to demand that they must follow that through by going beyond what others are doing in other circumstances. Really good post. Having a go at a footballer regarding shirt sponsorship is a low blow. Betting firms, airlines, enterprises funded by unsuitable states, car companies - yes there's a lot of blood spilt in the names that end up on the shirts. Hard to see how any individual player could dodge this or get a voice into their club's leadership powerful enough to have any effect. I also think there's a trend these days to hold famous people up to puritanical ideals too often. I also think we need to be more understanding of how people mature. I had anger and passion for injustice in my teens, but didn't know how to express myself or direct it. Also, who would listen to me as a nomark spotty shy teen? As you become older you understand how to put your point across well and how to use some influence within the places you work or your social groups. A teenage Rashford isn't going to have the influence of the man he is now, with more confidence in himself, more of a platform and more standing amongst his peers. What can a footballer actually reasonably do within their career to push the envelope? Respect to Sterling and Rashford for showing a way. I think the exanmples they have both shown are remarkable given how they are still both quite young men. Carlos Puyol also comes to mind too.
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