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Post by ivangolac on Jun 7, 2021 11:36:10 GMT
We are going to waste some serious attacking talent in this tournament and Southgate will be to blame.
He is weak and in love with the star players in his squad, pandering to their every need. So much so that we are going into a tournament:
1) With at least two players who are clearly not and nowhere near fit. I can just about accept Henderson as he is fully taking part, but picking Maguire when he wont be fit for any of the group games is ridiculous. It is undermining the others picked who all look shot. Play well Tyrone, and I'll drop you as soon as my favourite is back.
2) Doesn't know his best keeper
3) Gives 8 days off to Chelsea and City players rather than ask them to play 45 minutes in a 'best side' to protect their 'emotions'
4) Final warm up game, gives all set pieces to someone he has no intention of picking, even states he was on Pens.....
5) No idea on final formation
6) Makes Rashford captain when he doesn't even deserve to be in the side
7) and who the feck wheres a blue terry-cloth Polo shirt under a grey suit, with the top button done up FFS.....Who the hell does he think he is?
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Post by Furry Frank The Combat Wombat on Jun 7, 2021 12:24:35 GMT
I don't know why anyone is surprised; he was never going to be a particularly good manager, and he's only there because he's a yes man to the FA. I'm not sure I even blame him, it's the standard Ingalun fayre of selecting individuals instead of building a team. Southgate's merely doing the job he was hired to do (not embarrass us too much while keeping all the bigwigs' troughs well filled)
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Post by arfurdent on Jun 7, 2021 12:34:14 GMT
I don't know why anyone is surprised; he was never going to be a particularly good manager, and he's only there because he's a yes man to the FA. I'm not sure I even blame him, it's the standard Ingalun fayre of selecting individuals instead of building a team. Southgate's merely doing the job he was hired to do (not embarrass us too much while keeping all the bigwigs' troughs well filled) that totally sums up why the FA grandees never gave Brian Clough the England job. Last manager to really stand up to them was Alf Ramsey
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Post by spot51 on Jun 7, 2021 14:11:47 GMT
B O A C.
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Post by Furry Frank The Combat Wombat on Jun 7, 2021 14:54:34 GMT
That ended when I was 11 (days)
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Post by saintsfan73 on Jun 7, 2021 15:14:54 GMT
I don't know why anyone is surprised; he was never going to be a particularly good manager, and he's only there because he's a yes man to the FA. I'm not sure I even blame him, it's the standard Ingalun fayre of selecting individuals instead of building a team. Southgate's merely doing the job he was hired to do (not embarrass us too much while keeping all the bigwigs' troughs well filled) I'm not quite sure why but Southgate seems to be getting a huge amount of undeserved grief from fans currently. Sir Bobby Robson was manager in a WC when we scraped through the group stages, needed a last minute ET winner to get through the last 16, was losing to one of world football's lesser names before getting through due to 2 late pens and then lost to the Germans and yet he was treated as a national hero for the rest of his life and documentaries are still being made about Italia '90 to this day. Yet Southgate took over a team who, at the proceeding WC , had got knocked out with only a single point against the mighty Costa Ricans and had been knocked out of the last Euros by Iceland and took them to the WC semi-final and it seems to have been largely forgotten already. Some of the things he's been critisised with are a bit harsh. Of course he gave an extra week's rest to the CL players given how intense this season had been. Can you imagine the grief he would have got if Foden or Mount had torn a hamstring while playing a meaningless game against Romania? He may well not know his best team, but with a large number of young players and precious few games to play each year this is understandable. I think people need to realise the standard of managers that international teams get. It's either domestic managers at the fag end of their careers like Uncle Woy or Fat Sam or foreign mercenaries like Capello. If Southgate did get the boot we'd be looking at the likes of Pards.....
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Post by arfurdent on Jun 7, 2021 15:40:02 GMT
I don't know why anyone is surprised; he was never going to be a particularly good manager, and he's only there because he's a yes man to the FA. I'm not sure I even blame him, it's the standard Ingalun fayre of selecting individuals instead of building a team. Southgate's merely doing the job he was hired to do (not embarrass us too much while keeping all the bigwigs' troughs well filled) I'm not quite sure why but Southgate seems to be getting a huge amount of undeserved grief from fans currently. Sir Bobby Robson was manager in a WC when we scraped through the group stages, needed a last minute ET winner to get through the last 16, was losing to one of world football's lesser names before getting through due to 2 late pens and then lost to the Germans and yet he was treated as a national hero for the rest of his life and documentaries are still being made about Italia '90 to this day. Yet Southgate took over a team who, at the proceeding WC , had got knocked out with only a single point against the mighty Costa Ricans and had been knocked out of the last Euros by Iceland and took them to the WC semi-final and it seems to have been largely forgotten already. Some of the things he's been critisised with are a bit harsh. Of course he gave an extra week's rest to the CL players given how intense this season had been. Can you imagine the grief he would have got if Foden or Mount had torn a hamstring while playing a meaningless game against Romania? He may well not know his best team, but with a large number of young players and precious few games to play each year this is understandable. I think people need to realise the standard of managers that international teams get. It's either domestic managers at the fag end of their careers like Uncle Woy or Fat Sam or foreign mercenaries like Capello. If Southgate did get the boot we'd be looking at the likes of Pards..... or Harry
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Post by Willshakes. on Jun 7, 2021 17:06:40 GMT
I'm okay with Southgate. Not his tactics. I.E 4 now 3 Right backs. The last WC was great. I don't think anyone could disagree with that. If Klopp was the Manager it may change a tad. It's all "If's, but's and maybe's". Isn't that the story of a Saints Fans life
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Post by Furry Frank The Combat Wombat on Jun 7, 2021 17:30:20 GMT
I don't know why anyone is surprised; he was never going to be a particularly good manager, and he's only there because he's a yes man to the FA. I'm not sure I even blame him, it's the standard Ingalun fayre of selecting individuals instead of building a team. Southgate's merely doing the job he was hired to do (not embarrass us too much while keeping all the bigwigs' troughs well filled) I'm not quite sure why but Southgate seems to be getting a huge amount of undeserved grief from fans currently. Sir Bobby Robson was manager in a WC when we scraped through the group stages, needed a last minute ET winner to get through the last 16, was losing to one of world football's lesser names before getting through due to 2 late pens and then lost to the Germans and yet he was treated as a national hero for the rest of his life and documentaries are still being made about Italia '90 to this day. Yet Southgate took over a team who, at the proceeding WC , had got knocked out with only a single point against the mighty Costa Ricans and had been knocked out of the last Euros by Iceland and took them to the WC semi-final and it seems to have been largely forgotten already. Some of the things he's been critisised with are a bit harsh. Of course he gave an extra week's rest to the CL players given how intense this season had been. Can you imagine the grief he would have got if Foden or Mount had torn a hamstring while playing a meaningless game against Romania? He may well not know his best team, but with a large number of young players and precious few games to play each year this is understandable. I think people need to realise the standard of managers that international teams get. It's either domestic managers at the fag end of their careers like Uncle Woy or Fat Sam or foreign mercenaries like Capello. If Southgate did get the boot we'd be looking at the likes of Pards..... As above, I don't really blame him for the selection nonsense; he (and many managers before him) are hamstrung by the press/FA to shoehorn in individual players instead of building a team.. other countries (often with far fewer resources or players available) manage to produce teams that are more than the sum of their parts, but the concept seems to evade the England setup.
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Post by ivangolac on Jun 8, 2021 20:49:16 GMT
I'm okay with Southgate. Not his tactics. I.E 4 now 3 Right backs. The last WC was great. I don't think anyone could disagree with that. If Klopp was the Manager it may change a tad. It's all "If's, but's and maybe's". Isn't that the story of a Saints Fans life Was it though... Laboured to victory v. Tunisia.....Beat a terrible Panama and were terrible v. Belgium reserves (admittedly putting us in the right side of the draw. Froze and were lucky v. a bang average Columbia missing their best player and then rolled over a Sweden side who counldn't quite believe they'd made the Quarters. We were surviving for sure, but hardly brilliant. Tacticlly taken apart by Modric and then easily beaten in the 3/4..... We were bang average and had a load of luck on the way.
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Southgate
Jun 9, 2021 12:49:24 GMT
via mobile
Post by saintsfan73 on Jun 9, 2021 12:49:24 GMT
I'm okay with Southgate. Not his tactics. I.E 4 now 3 Right backs. The last WC was great. I don't think anyone could disagree with that. If Klopp was the Manager it may change a tad. It's all "If's, but's and maybe's". Isn't that the story of a Saints Fans life Was it though... Laboured to victory v. Tunisia.....Beat a terrible Panama and were terrible v. Belgium reserves (admittedly putting us in the right side of the draw. Froze and were lucky v. a bang average Columbia missing their best player and then rolled over a Sweden side who counldn't quite believe they'd made the Quarters. We were surviving for sure, but hardly brilliant. Tacticlly taken apart by Modric and then easily beaten in the 3/4..... We were bang average and had a load of luck on the way. That’s a cup competition though. You never play all the best teams and always need luck but only 4 teams can reach the semis. Robson got a knighthood off the back of a competition where we struggled to a draw with Ireland, had a drab goalless draw with Holland, barely beat Egypt with a late header, got a last minute ET winner against Belgium and beat Cameroon due to 2 late pens when we were losing. Then lost to Germany and Italy. Numerous films have been made about that one!!
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Post by arfurdent on Jun 9, 2021 16:27:39 GMT
Was it though... Laboured to victory v. Tunisia.....Beat a terrible Panama and were terrible v. Belgium reserves (admittedly putting us in the right side of the draw. Froze and were lucky v. a bang average Columbia missing their best player and then rolled over a Sweden side who counldn't quite believe they'd made the Quarters. We were surviving for sure, but hardly brilliant. Tacticlly taken apart by Modric and then easily beaten in the 3/4..... We were bang average and had a load of luck on the way. That’s a cup competition though. You never play all the best teams and always need luck but only 4 teams can reach the semis. Robson got a knighthood off the back of a competition where we struggled to a draw with Ireland, had a drab goalless draw with Holland, barely beat Egypt with a late header, got a last minute ET winner against Belgium and beat Cameroon due to 2 late pens when we were losing. Then lost to Germany and Italy. Numerous films have been made about that one!! ?
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Post by channonite on Jun 12, 2021 9:49:33 GMT
In the Times today, a bit long, but worth reading through:
England expects more than ever this summer but manager has proved time and again he must not be underestimated, writes Matt Dickinson
As you probably know, England is a nation of undiscovered managerial geniuses who could pick and coach a team to stuff Croatia on Sunday, triumph in the European Championship and guarantee that Jack Grealish wins the Ballon d’Or. Indeed, you may be one of them.
Many are sure they could do the job but given the FA, weirdly, ignored the bloke off Twitter and gave it to the guy with 57 international caps, four years of preparation with England Under-21 and experience of half a dozen major tournaments as player and coach, I thought you may want to know a few things about a man who will be under more scrutiny than the prime minister and a royal baby’s name over the next month.
Obviously the first thing you will want to know about Gareth Southgate is what he will be wearing on the sidelines during Euro 2020, and even that tells you something insightful about the England manager.
Often the national team heads into a tournament with a sponsored suit deal — David Beckham helped broker one with Armani in 2004, while a more modest England went M&S in 2018, including the coach’s famous waistcoat — but this time Southgate was free to choose.
Knowing the interest it would generate, he wondered how he could use the opportunity to help a young English tailor. Like promoting Jude Bellingham, he thought there must be home-grown talent out there deserving of a big chance. The patriot in him wanted to help English business. So the search went out and ended up with Chris Gove, the creative director of Percival Menswear, who put together a navy suit created in Tottenham (to go with English-made shoes and socks) that Southgate will wear on Sunday and beyond. There is no financial deal, just the hope of an opportunity embraced. A little touch, perhaps, but Southgate is uncommonly good at those.
If what follows is too admiring for some tastes, I should point out that Southgate will do me no favours over the next month. He is scrupulously fair, which is actually quite infuriating to reporters. We depend on a nod and a wink, a discreet chat for the inside track — and some England managers have obliged. Who does Southgate think he is, being equitable and decent to everyone?
Southgate breeds harmony in the camp, which can also be kryptonite to journalists. The leakiest England squads are generally the unhappiest (the 2006 World Cup instantly springs to mind for the bitching from within) as omitted players whinge about the coach or colleagues.
Under Southgate, finding out the teamsheet has never been more challenging because he set about creating a culture of ownership and responsibility. He told the players: “It’s your team, why would you want to tell the media and therefore the opposition?”
Managing England brings particular challenges — of ancient baggage, heavy expectation and failure foretold — and Southgate recognised that his job was to break this cycle. He was well-placed to understand it from his penalty miss at Euro ’96. He had felt that fear. He had been that scapegoat. He wanted to help England players find a better way.
He empowered the players and if some have pushed their luck — Dele Alli dropped for poor attitude; Raheem Sterling for a confrontation with Joe Gomez; Mason Greenwood and Phil Foden for inviting women back to a hotel in Iceland — Southgate has shown that he is a nice guy but no pushover.
How else may we understand him? Perhaps by his two books. The first, Woody and Nord, involved Southgate sharing the pages with his great mate Andy Woodman, who was a fellow apprentice at Crystal Palace but never made an appearance for the first team. It is subtitled A Football Friendship.
Southgate’s second book is called Anything Is Possible, targeted at young people and telling stories of dealing with adversity. “Be brave” and “be kind” are the messages on the cover. The proceeds have gone to the Prince’s Trust programme, Future Leaders. He thinks the position brings a responsibility to engage with this broader work, like making a film on YouTube about race, mental health and gender inequality with Yung Filly, ChrisMD and StuntPegg. It took a teenage son to tell me about that.
At this stage I can hear someone shouting: “So what?! His job is to win football matches.” Time to point out, then — especially when credit seems to have expired among many fans — that his record stands comparison with any England manager since Sir Alf Ramsey. A World Cup semi-final in his first tournament; overcoming Croatia and Spain to reach the finals of the Nations League.
There have, of course, been disappointments and mistakes. Who wasn’t frustrated that he did not try to change the shape when the back three became a beleaguered five as Croatia dominated that World Cup semi-final? I disagreed with reverting to the back three for much of the past 18 months as overly cautious. We can all have our moans around selection or tactics. But we have spent much of the past 55 years overestimating what England managers can and might do, and Southgate was underestimated — certainly by me. I reacted to his appointment to lead the under-21 side in 2013 with an underwhelmed sigh; doubtful if he was the man to take advantage of a new generation of technical English kids.
Considering that bizarre detour via Sam Allardyce, the FA got lucky with the man who had started as head of elite development, helping to nurture the nation’s promising youth, and understood how and why the international role was different.
As for sticking to football, Southgate answered that better than I could in his open letter in The Players’ Tribune this week, in which he made the point that only about 1,200 players have represented England at senior men’s level. It brings extraordinary prestige and profile.
“Our players are role models,” he wrote. “And, beyond the confines of the pitch, we must recognise the impact they can have on society. We must give them the confidence to stand up for their team-mates and the things that matter to them as people.”
Southgate encouraged Sterling to overcome misconceptions by telling the story of a very dilcult upbringing; a candour that Marcus Rashford harnessed for his campaign for free school meals for underprivileged children.
When the players take a knee, Southgate says that he is a middle-aged white man with a duty to try to understand the obstacles that the young black players have faced, and still do. When he said he had “no right to be tired” of this issue, he was not taking sides in a culture war but seeking to be an empathetic leader.
“Of course, my players and I will be judged on winning matches,” he says. And there is a weight of expectation given the bright attacking players in his squad.
I write this piece as a hostage to fortune given that England have not kicked a ball yet. It could all go wrong. One glance at central defence reveals an undeniable fragility. To make England champions will take more than a steady hand on the tiller.
England could stumble at any stage, and we have seen often enough how an England manager’s reputation is torched by tournament failure, and he is never the same again. But I don’t see that happening this summer.
The sensible grown-up in the room when it comes to all the heat and noise and fury generated by English football, Southgate will be fine whatever happens. He will keep his perspective. In this mad, shouty world we seem to live in, it’s all those other England managers I worry about.
England v Croatia Kick-o@ 2pm Sunday, June 13 Wembley Stadium TV: BBC 1 Radio: talkSPORT,BBC 5 Live
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Southgate
Jun 13, 2021 12:06:29 GMT
via mobile
Post by sotonian on Jun 13, 2021 12:06:29 GMT
He’s dropped an in form left back to play someone out of position 🤷♂️ As suspected he’s playing Sterling and dropped Grealish, Southgate is an idiot !
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Post by Furry Frank The Combat Wombat on Jun 13, 2021 13:43:19 GMT
He’s dropped an in form left back to play someone out of position 🤷♂️ As suspected he’s playing Sterling and dropped Grealish, Southgate is an idiot ! Doesn't seem a great plan. First half so far a Saints performance, lots of huff and puff to no avail Except they won a jwp-area free kick and forgot to have jwp on it.
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